In case you haven't seen the video click here. A lot of water yes. A catastrophe no. When I moved to Evansville I looked at two houses near retention ponds one in the area seen on the video and another directly in front of the very large one on the North side of Porter Rd.
Great lots great houses except............ They are near retention ponds and I have young children so I moved up the hill. You can't tell me the people who bought these houses did not realize what they were buying. Pretty obvious a big hole with a drainage ditch running to it.
While I can understand the frustration the talk of the City paying to fix it is ridiculous(next you'll be complaining about taxes) . It's like building a house next to the Interstate and asking the City to pay for a sound barrier because it's too loud.
You built the house now live in it.
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While waiting for the election results I had an idea.
Leave Leota the way it is and put a park around Lake Westfield Meadows.
Personally I am not asking the city to do anything at this point. I did ask them (plan commission) not to approve more development behind me. Some people that voted for Westfield Meadows have stated they voted that way to help the 6th street water issues. I don't believe more development is going to help. My my main point of posting the video is documenting that the water situation appears to be worse now that they are starting on Westfield Meadows. They are raising this low lying area with fill dirt to bring it up to the same ground level as Abey Koth subdivision. This obviously will will displace more water into the pond (previously there was more potential to overflow to the low lying farmland rather than yards) Additionally once there are more roofs, roads, potentially a parking lot,etc. this will exacerbate the problem more since these surfaces will not absorb water. If I lose property value due to more regular water problems or suffer foundation damage because of it, I will have an issue with the city and the developers and I am on record many times at plan commission meetings speaking against this.
My property doesn't have a drainage ditch running through it, so it isn't even really an annoyance or irratation for me, the reason I posted the video is that I wanted to bring attention to the fact that some people do have standing water in their yards. Contrary to what Bill Connors says this is not how it is supposed to work. The water is supposed to run through the ditch to the pond. The pond is not supposed to overflow and flow backwards into the ditch.
I posted more specifics in regard to Bill Connors post on the Observer, but it hasn't been posted yet. I assume it will post there sometime, If not I will post my full reply here.
Well its a good thing you live on a damn hill. These people when they bought there homes, never dreamed they would have lake front property. No one ever said, by the way when it rains, get out your boat. Mr.Connors explanation is a joke, his comment is 'its working'. I challenge him on that.ITs not working, I drove through that area, there are retention ponds right up next to peoples houses that need to be fenced off, before some little child escapes there parents and drowns. ( It happens to the best of people in the best of places) There is water standing in their back yards, there are swing sets standing in this water. Kids can't even use their own back yards. When this developer came to the planning commission wanting to build these homes, they , the planning commission were warned there has always been high water tables out in the area they wanted to build. There was concern then and I agree with Mark the more they build and displace this water the worse it will get. Those homes out in that area are not worth what they paid for them, with the water issues as they are now. My thought is as well is there is as much water surrounding these houses as there is on the outside, you know there is water in the basement of these NEW houses. Our house is over 100 years old and I don't get water in the basement or my back yard. You should try having a little empathy it could have been you.
The retention pond at 6th and vision never empties, period. They dug a retention pond (Crull), right at the water table during a drought summer. Other than that dry summer, this supposed retention pond has never emptied. I complained to the city that this is a problem because children do play in this area and they put up an "orange snow fence" for several weeks.
Additionally this is just still water that is a mosquito magnet in the summer. This isn't doing anything as far as water and should be filled in.
anon, (who I believe is packerfan)
It is a damn good thing I live on a hill and it isn't by happenstance.I chose to live here so I wouldn't have the problems these people are having.
I am also happy for you and your dry 100 year old yard and basement.
Do I feel sorry that the kids that can't play in their yards on their swing sets? Yes.
However the owners of the effected areas knew they were buying a house next to or near a retention pond.With that comes risk.
If it were me I would get together with my neighboors and come up with a plan of attack. There is strenghth in numbers people.
Conversation with a realtor circa 2001:
Home Buyer: "You know the wife and I just love the layout of this home."
Realtor: "Yes it is one of the best plans in this subdivision."
HB: "We are a bit concerned by how low the ground is over here though."
R: "There is nothing to worry about. And by the way did you notice how close you are to the schools? Also they will be building a large park right up the road from you."
HB: "Yeah being close to the schools is great, but I am still a bit concerned about the grade."
R: "The builder has assured me that the grade is exactly where it needs to be in order for the water flow to run into retention ponds and not into your basement. Of course if water were to run into your basement, which it won't, you do have a full 1 year warranty on construction."
HB: "You're right. I love this house. We will put in an offer today."
Hmmmmmm....sounds to me like you get what you pay for. A good point was made and that is at the end of the day it comes down to buyer's choice. If the buyers in this area bought based upon a conversation like the one above then...well what did P.T. Barnum supposedly say? Something about a type of person born every minute?
ok you got me jeff I posted as anony as i was being lazy and in a hurry at the time. good to see you are capable of seeing a point of view besides your own. They need to get a lawyer. I get sick everytime i read bill connors explanation.
anon before last packerfan post sounds like a developer or Realtor who screwed these people. What goes around does eventually come around. We have a friend that is building here in town, actually right out side city limits, and they asked us who we would recommend when they were looking for a builder and we told them no one from this town, not a builder or real estate agent choose them both carefully and wisely. Check out other work they have done, five years ago and see if the people are still happy. They chose someone from over by Belleville who had done business for years , incredible ref. and never has built in a swamp.
The other point Jeff I think needs to be made and I don't know how long you have lived here, I thought someone said two years? When people buy a home they should be able to buy with confidence, that they are buying on a wet , swampy area, the city was warned years, years, ago about the land where these houses sit about how high the water tables were, and how when it rains there was usually standing water. They were warned and chose to ignore and twist things to fit there own needs. They are to a point responsible. So are the builders, and so to a very small degree the homeowner who bought the house next to the retaining pond, but that does not account for all those houses with water issues. I talked with someone last summer who had to have his basement wall replaced, home less than five yrs old. This is in no way a normal amount of water damage this is over and beyond.
I drove by today and the water levels appeared to have gone down.The retention pond is full but the water in the back yards has subsided.
The new soccer fields on the Westside are not at this point flooded. I had not seen them prior to today but they appear to be in good shape.
Could the high water levels have to do with the ground still being somewhat frozen thus taking it longer to absorb?
How many homes are truly affected by this? 2,4, or more?
Mark, maybe you or Grumps could shed some light on that as you are in the neigborhood.
My thought is,
this is my hometown, your hometown. I expect more from my hometown. To the anon who said, "there's one of these born every minute," but this is Evansville. I expect higher standards from our community. We see each other everyday at the Pig, downtown, or at church. The thought that one (or several) of our own would be doing this to people is disgusting. Nows the time, developers and city, to save face and fix it. Stand up and be a man (or woman).
PS, No I don't own effected property.
This may be "our" hometown, but my wallet is most certainly filled with MY money.
Why don't you try to get ABC Home makeover in here to fix the problem. Of course generally that show has people on it with problems that make Lake Westfiled Meadows look like a sliver (aka not a major problem).
Here is the deal- we have heard from one affected property owner (Mark schnepper?) and he sort of said what he was going to do about it. Until I hear from more of the affected people on here rather than just people that seem to want to blame developers in this area/realtors in this area/the city or anyone else but the property owners themselves than it just seems like the problem pales in comparison to the people who want to make this a problem.
/Granted I live nowehere near this "Lake" and I am not even a property owner, but nonetheless I have an opinion on whining. And don't give me that "you don't even know or understand", because I understand full well that I would not move into a swamp. Let alone buy and/or build there.
Last anon, you sound like you might have a bridge to sell.
So you're saying, some young 20-something with a new baby or two, who moves to town, finds a great house in a great subdivision, hasn't a clue about home buying or whatever, thinks they can trust the realtor/whoever... and then that someone sells them a house knowing full well there are water issues... then it's just too bad for those kids?
Yes, we know the problems and wouldn't buy there, but what about those innocent who move to town not knowing about the predisposed problems?
What kind of world are you building? Let's build a better Evansville!
Last anon-
So I guess you are saying that 'yes indeed there is a sucker born every minute, but we better take care of those suckers for the betterment of the community.'
If that is what you are saying then fine you are entitled to that opinion. Although that makes you a socialist, a nice socialist, but a socialist none the less.
That being said you don't have to go to the "kids" suffering argument. It's not like those ficticious kids are living in an African village and Sally Struthers is crying for us to give them a handful of rice. Sheesh. You have no idea what the situation is of the people who live on the beautiful shores of Lake Westfield Meadows. Thay may be beach people and their kids are aspiring Olympic swimmers. I know that is a bit ridiculous, but then again so is making an argument for the betterment of the community by making up fantastic scenarios of doom and gloom.
At the end of the day this is just a waterflow issue. Not a huge deal in the big scheme of things. Call someone over at the city and whine a bit and somebody will probably do something or call someone. If they don't and you think you have a legitimate gripe take whatever party you feel is responsible to court. If that seems like too much to do or you just don't want to go that route then sit and cry in your backyard lake, because even though one anon poster in here wants the community to be a better place and look out for incoming "innocent" citizens with 2 babies and a head lacking any common sense, I guarentee that the same anon guy was fighting to not have a Westfiled Meadows at all and to keep residential growth in Evansville lower than it currently is because he is one of those guys that is always whining that guys like Berg make too much money and are therefore evil.
Gimme a break.
I am curious, someone explain please. I talked with someone and it does not sound like its just one area out there, or one developer. I was told Berg and Ric Eager are involved knee high in this. I was also told Ric Eager has been banned from doing anymore work in Albany , Oregon and Belleville. Because he has no ethics and they have had alot of trouble with him doing what he agreed to do.
Evansville seems to pride it self on its ' unethical builders' welcomes them with open arms.
If you call being a man, doing the right thing, and NOT RIPPING PEOPLE OFF, then I guess I am a socialist.
When I said kids, I meant the 20-something year olds who are stuck with a house that nobody in their right mind would want -- unless they sell it to another naive person, thus perpetuating the evil is as evil does theory.
THis may be the world you are creating but not me. Hope to not ever do business with you.
Selling a house near a retention pond is evil?
This guy has clearly never heard the expression 'Judge not, lest ye be judged.'
Yes, selling a house next to a detention pond is evil, if the seller knows there will be water problems and doesn't stop it or warn the person IN WRITING.
Do unto others as you'd have done to yourself. First commandment, above all others.
I know my Bible too.
Last anon,
Actually the First Commandment is....
Thou Shall have no other gods before me.
Apparently you don't know your bible.
Several things I would like to bring up. At this point, this is an irritation to me, as Jeff accurately pointed out. I haven't had any standing water in my yard and I have had a dry basement from the beginning 4+ years. Other people may feel differently that have had more issues than myself. If standing water happens every four years in the neighborhood, whatever. Hopefully other people aren't taking on water.
If I am not having any problems, why did I attempt to stir up some trouble with a video? Because this happened after three dry years and then a 2 inch rain causes problems when similar rains didn't cause any issues in the past now that the development of Westfield Meadows has begun. To me it is logical to deduce there is a relationship. So yes, I wanted to bring attention to the fact that 2 inches of rain is causing a problem when 2 inches hasn't been an issue in the past. Bill Connors proclaimed(at the Observer), "To say Westfield Meadows Subdivision is blameless for the results of the most recent rain is completely accurate." He has a right to his opinion I have a right to mine as well. However, he doesn't own the facts. He he can't proclaim that as an absolute truth without any facts to back it up.
If the water issue intensifys once the roads, shingles,etc. are in place and causing more water issues, you can bet I'll try to stir something up; if it causes me financial issues, I do intend to take action as previously stated. At this point I don't have any legal argument, I can't go to court on a speculation of what might happen once 200 homes are displacing more water behind me.
If this is not an isolated incident unrelated to Westfield (Connors claims it must have been a clogged storm drain and has nothing to do with Westfield Meadows), it is hard for me to see how the City and Berg are not at fault? Berg asked for land to be annexed into Evansville that was previously considered unusable green space. If developing this land that was deemed unusable causes me problems how is that my fault? They city gave the O.K. when they could have denied the request, why are they blameless?
It is both amusing and ironic that the anonymous know it all, found the remedy of telling the city to fix it for us naive people. This is naive in itself and this person has obviously never dealt with the city. If the city listened to the people Westfield wouldn't be happening at all. Many people attended meetings and spoke out against this project and stated it was a bad idea for a variety of reasons. Burden on taxpayers by overpopulating the school, water issues, etc.etc. I don't believe anybody spoke favorably of the project that didn't have a financial interest in it.
I don't know that anybody has an issue with Roger Berg making money. What people do have an issue with is him getting deals that other people would not get. Him getting deals that affect other people's property and potentially affect everyone's elses property taxes (if you think taxes are bad now in Evansville, just wait until we outgrow the High School before the bonds are paid off).
Pt Barnum said...................
I say there is a cowardly asshole born every moment and most of them are anonymously attacking people on blogs!
P.S. I think the city does have some obligation to see that a project has been executed correctly when they sign off on it. If all of the water problems are a result of abey koth not being executed correctly when it was built, why did the City of Evansville sign off on the project instead of keeping pressure on Rick Eager bring things up to the agreed upon standard of design? Is it really that unrealistic to ask that the City not approve projects that shouldn't be built in the place or sign off on projects that have been poorly executed and don't meet the standards that were agreed upon between the City and the developer?
Also, if Ralph Crull squeezed another $40,000 out of the South end of 6th street by putting in a lot that he knew shouldn't go in, that is clearly not right and if you can't see that you have your own problems with morals and ethics. He screwed me out of $250 on a minor landscaping project around 1999. Long story but after it happened a local contactor told me, yeah that is R&K, bid low and make a mess of things.
The City or R&K should fill in the 6th street and vision pond. It is not collecting any water (because it is consistantly full)and could be a hazard for kids (I don't let me kids play unattended, but I have seen kids playing around that water down there that are probably young enough that they shouldn't be down there unattended). It is also a mosquito mosquito breeding haven because the water isn't moving. Ultimately the taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for it, but I would imagine it is too late to make him do the work or do the work and charge him for it.
Well this is a fun comment thread.
Can't we just comment about the Brewers and how they will probably break my heart yet again.
Snob,
By the end of the season I will break your heart!! Even more certainly, but the end of September the Brewers will break your heart!!
Jim
April 23, 2007 6:oo p.m. Public Works.
Any and all who wish to address the public works committee can at this time.
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